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"Hoag" goes to Hollywood? 
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Heinlein Nexus
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Post Re: "Hoag" goes to Hollywood?
James Gifford wrote:
I believe James Cameron already did. On the heels of his take on Starship Troopers. :?


If you're referring to Dark Angel, I never got why people thought that was a Friday ripoff. Great little series, but any resemblance to Friday was down near the level of shared alphabets.


Fri Jan 23, 2009 1:22 pm
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Post Re: "Hoag" goes to Hollywood?
Peter Scott wrote:
James Gifford wrote:
I believe James Cameron already did. On the heels of his take on Starship Troopers. :?

If you're referring to Dark Angel, I never got why people thought that was a Friday ripoff. Great little series, but any resemblance to Friday was down near the level of shared alphabets.

I never saw the series but a huge number of points, as summarized in most capsule descriptions (such as Wackypedia) sound like back-cover blurbs for Friday.

Genetically enhanced female of mixed race, raised by institution, trained as assassin/courier, searching a broken-down America for her family, yadda yadda... that's closer to the book than Verhoover's ST was.

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Fri Jan 23, 2009 3:40 pm
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Post Re: "Hoag" goes to Hollywood?
dh490311 wrote:
James Gifford wrote:
dh490311 wrote:
I also think he'd do a bang-up job with Friday.

I believe James Cameron already did. On the heels of his take on Starship Troopers. :?

Well, if imdb.com is to be believed, I don't think his takes on either Starship Troopers or Friday has more than just a passing resemblance to either Heinlein story.

I agree. The "crossing over to lead the indigenes" sounds like 90 degrees from Starship Troopers, and I never thought Dark Angel bore any resemblance at all to Friday. It was an angsty comic book.


Fri Jan 23, 2009 4:13 pm
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Post Re: "Hoag" goes to Hollywood?
James Gifford wrote:
I never saw the series but a huge number of points, as summarized in most capsule descriptions (such as Wackypedia) sound like back-cover blurbs for Friday.

Genetically enhanced female of mixed race, raised by institution, trained as assassin/courier, searching a broken-down America for her family, yadda yadda... that's closer to the book than Verhoover's ST was.


Tsk. The organization that trained her was not run by any Baldwinesque figure nor for any righteous purpose but instead as a covert paramilitary brainwashing experiment. She was a soldier rather than an assassin. After she escaped she became the brawn for a subversive much like Adam Selene. The courier job was her cover... as a bicycle messenger delivering UPS-type packages. Rather than a bucolic America fractured into multiple states, you had a dirty country scrabbling for survival after a terrorist EMP wiped out most of the electronic infrastructure. Any parallel is what English jurisprudence quaintly refers to as a "strained and unnatural interpretation." Case not proven, m'lud.

The Bionic Woman was just as close. Female with superhuman abilities... working for secret government agency dedicated to righting the evils of the world... beating up bad guys... searching for meaning in a crazy mixed-up world...


Fri Jan 23, 2009 10:19 pm
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Post Re: "Hoag" goes to Hollywood?
*shrug*. I think the points noted, as a whole, make a sufficiently unique fingerprint, no matter what other elements don't match.

The only things the Bionic Woman had in common were far more generic: female lead, techo-superpowers, fighting eeeevil. But then, she was an otherwise normal white woman working for an upright, flag-waving 'Murrican gummint, fighting cartoon Bad Guys. No fingerprint at all there (not surprising, since it was a wholly created-for-TV spinoff of 6MDM, itself a sanitized version of a far more interesting novel).

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Sat Jan 24, 2009 10:35 am
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Post Re: "Hoag" goes to Hollywood?
James Gifford wrote:
*shrug*. I think the points noted, as a whole, make a sufficiently unique fingerprint, no matter what other elements don't match.

The only things the Bionic Woman had in common were far more generic: female lead, techo-superpowers, fighting eeeevil. But then, she was an otherwise normal white woman working for an upright, flag-waving 'Murrican gummint, fighting cartoon Bad Guys. No fingerprint at all there (not surprising, since it was a wholly created-for-TV spinoff of 6MDM, itself a sanitized version of a far more interesting novel).

I watched the first few episodes of Dark Angel and then lost interest. Jessica Alba is just too darned *pouty* to take seriously. But I have to say I got no impression of similarity to Friday from watching the show; the first time I heard someone liken it to the book, I was startled. It really didn't convey any sense of similarity -- it was really more comic-book-conventional, and that tended to wash out the points of similarity in my impression. That is, there were some points of similarity -- but they (Cameron) really didn't do the same kinds of thing with those points.


Sat Jan 24, 2009 11:06 am
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Post Re: "Hoag" goes to Hollywood?
Again, all I can add is *shrug*. I watched neither that series nor any other television for lo these many decades, so I pontificate from a distance.

I know others more familiar with the series have drawn the same inferences.

I throw down the challenge to find any other source of those component ideas, other than that H'weird thinks JC can walk on intellectual water. He's clearly familiar with Heinlein - see the concepts and dialogue in Aliens. I can't think of any other place those five key components could have been taken from - and television (especially serial entertainment teevee) NEVER originates ideas.


Sat Jan 24, 2009 12:51 pm
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Post Re: Joss Whedon and Heinlein
dh490311 wrote:
Speaking of Firefly, I'd love to see what Joss Whedon could do with pretty much any Heinlein story. My wildest dream: A series based on Time Enough for Love. I also think he'd do a bang-up job with Friday.
I believe Whedon's Firefly and Serenity display a thoughtful empathy with some important Heinlein principles -- of which a liking for brave, competent, and independent individuals is one of the most important. Whedon also understands the potential of the High Frontier for humanity, and that SF does not require aliens nor even much special effects to be exotic, witty, funny, and dramatic.

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Sat Jan 24, 2009 2:14 pm
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Post Re: "Hoag" goes to Hollywood?
James Gifford wrote:
No fingerprint at all there (not surprising, since it was a wholly created-for-TV spinoff of 6MDM, itself a sanitized version of a far more interesting novel).


Yes, it was - a far more interesting novel that is. And virtually impossible to find these days, along with at least two sequels that were written. The best 6MDM episode was the first one, because it actually followed several points of the novel.


Sat Jan 24, 2009 7:14 pm
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Post Re: "Hoag" goes to Hollywood?
There are cheap copies on ABEbooks, but I don't think it's been reprinted since the original appearance.

For those who are going "Huh?" the topic here is Martin Caidin's novel Cyborg, which was the source material for the Six Million Dollar Man series. I was unaware that there were sequels. I should pick these up for a (re)read.

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Sat Jan 24, 2009 9:09 pm
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